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Saturday, 10 May 2008

Sleeping Around: Wiki-smut?

By Catherine Townsend

The free online encyclopedia Wikipedia is being criticised by Conservative groups who claim that it's a repository for salacious porn and are worried about children gaining access to XXX images, according to Fleshbot.

Among the so-called "smut" on offer: videos of nude men participating in "ejaculation educational demonstrations", detailed photographs of men and women masturbating, images of mammary intercourse, and close-up images of topless women and male and female sexual anatomy.

But part of the beauty of Wikipedia is the fact that it's policed by users, who work to fix offensive content. Most of the so-called "salacious" images are pretty tame, many of them are no more graphic than one would find in a medical textbook.

I remember sneaking off to my parents' study with the Encyclopedia Britannica under one arm and looking up "penis", and kids are going to do the same thing online. They could do a lot worse than Wikipedia - at least it's a frank, trustworthy source of information.

Comments

Oh God Catherine please give it a rest. Like a child who gleefully looks up anything to do with sex you then parade your rank offerings to the grown ups. To shock? To amuse? One of your recent blogs told us all that you had sex with a man, and then went out with his son - adding that the sex was "animalistic".

That sounds like incest.

SORDID.

SORDID.

SORDID.

Please grow up and find something else to occupy your time with. Talking for hours over anything remotely related to gasp! copulating is showing a very limited repertoire. Go back to school. Read something useful. Just stop trying to be entertaining. You're ...not.

CT's blogs are getting to be a drag. What is the point of reading about the tawdry and tired subjects she bangs on about ? The office secretary has got more intelligent things to say. (And she's about 10 years younger than CT).

It amazes me how The Independent even still has you as a writer, this amazement is further fuelled by you saying rubbish such as Wikipedia is a "trustworthy source of information."

Last time Catherine was saying she did tonnes of charity work. Sleeping with half the men in London doesn't count Catherine.

There is nothing witty or ironic or feminine in the article she wrote here. Why is she even being paid to push mindless rubbish here?

Face it Sleeping Around as a blog has had its day. It's about as interesting as having your teeth pulled out. Probably worse.

Catherine Townsend.

Rest In Peace.

Put this tired, crappy old blog to rest now.

Get a proper job.

Catherine's mindset reminds me of a teenager who doesn't feel loved and so overcompensates eg by shagging anything in sight. Not a healthy focus. In such cases sex is a crutch for these people who "need" something to make them feel better. People with healthy attitudes don't obsess over anything. They don't have to prove their worth to society by having to prove how "desirable" they are. Take a walk and look at the world. Plenty of people who have interesting conversations which could open your eyes to life. In your mid to late thirties Catherine and you still need to prove your worth? Boring hearing endlessly how you spend your life on your back with your legs in the air making noises like a heiffer. Your juvenile columns are painfully devoid of any merit.

Thanks for pointing out how the Christian right are starting this campaign against Wikipedia. I agree with you that I'd rather my kids found out about sex on Wikipedia than by trying out searches on the open internet. Wikipedia is closely policed by users and the images there are unlikely to be considered outrageous by anyone but the ultra "everything sexual is bad" brigade who think ignorance is purity is good.

Myanmar just had a cyclone. They need people without anything better to do to volunteer.

I'm a Wikipedia addict myself, and I hope that they stick to their policy of not allowing censorship...allowing anyone to edit the entries is not a perfect system, but it's what has allowed the site to thrive in the digital age. This was a posting about Internet censorship, so I don't understand the mentality of those who find Ms Townsend's blog so 'boring' or 'offensive' that they a) come back to read them again and again, and b) take the time out of their day to post such personal responses.

When I was a child my parents not only had an encyclopedia, it was one on sex and relationships. I applaud Wiki for having the foresight to realize that the Christian right is, as usual, wrong and to present the info WITHOUT the added guilt and repression that the judeo/Christian dogma brings. And Matt? Incest is when one family member has sex with another and is regarded as wrong not only by the vocal minority but by many scientists for genetic reasons. You might want to think of being quiet so people only THINK you're a moron.

Dear Catherine,

In response to the many of your blogs that I have now read, I find the fact that you are so openly promoting casual sex without discussing the negative aspects of your lifestyle very disturbing.

The atmosphere of your blogs belies the intended message that you are an independent woman enjoying a free lifestyle, instead conveying the impression that you are actually insecure, internally questioning your lifestyle but also seeking encouragement and approval from others in an attempt to console yourself, much in the way that a drug addict will attempt to promote drug use and seek solace with other addicts rather than face their own problems. Maybe you also think that you are a pioneering icon of femininity, in which case may I point out that the sexual revolution of the 60s was forty years ago and that you have been preceded by plenty of "high-profile" supersluts, many of whom have questionable self-esteem and states of mental health.

In reference to a comment on your blog "Sleeping around: What will the neighbours say" (in which you describe masturbating while your neighbour is watching you whilst the son of your ex-boyfriend, who you are also currently sleeping with, is away in the US) by Brigitta, I agree that your blogs do absolutely nothing to help the problems of men and women in society today. Have you ever considered that there are probably many young and insecure girls who read your blog? If I was an impressionable girl who was in a stable long-term relationship, reading your blog would make me feel that there was something wrong with me, that I was boring or unadventurous. Many of your blogs glorify promiscuity, without mentioning the increased risk of STDs, low self-esteem, psychological and financial insecurity, broken relationships and the possibility of being looked down on in society (whether you think this is right or wrong, it is a fact and applies to men as well; a quick look at many of the comments to your blogs provides some starting research).

I am not anti-sexual freedom in any way at all. I am also not anti-alcohol. But then I would also oppose someone writing blogs on behalf of a national mainstream newspaper about how great it was to be heavy drinker without stating the negative aspects of their lifestyle. What you do in your own life is your own business. However what I am opposed to is promoting your views as a role model with absolutely no regard for the consequences of your readership.

I have absolutely no idea how you managed to get your job at the Independent or why they feel that reporting such as yours is an asset to what is otherwise, for me, the leading newspaper in the UK. Is this some kind of crazily mistaken effort to make news cool for kids?

My final point (that I feel I need to make after reading some of your comments from male "fans" about up-tight, sexually-frustrated biddies etc.) is that I am a 24-year old heavy metal guitarist who has had several girlfriends and an active sexual life. I am not religious, do not support any government and fiercely promote independent thought. I completely agree with freedom of choice. What I do not agree with is using a powerfully influential position such as yours to encourage impressionable people that promiscuity is exciting and fun without making them aware of the many negative effects of this lifestyle.

Please resign.

Best wishes,

Marcus

Porn on wiki? That's a surprise. However I think Catherine is right. On the internet porn is readily available as is water to fish under the sea. Slating wiki for showing nude pictures is the least. If it was that much of an offense then all those other encyclopedias showing nude pictures of genitalia and the such should also be slated.

As for Catherine. Glorification of her promiscuity on a blog is simply her business. It's no different than standing on a street corner and shouting out I'm a hoe, or a terrible soap opera. Nevertheless one can stand and listen or simply cover one's ears and move on. I find it utterly wasteful that a person would contend Catherine's position on this. It's her right to say what she wants and if someone reading her blog is somehow negatively influenced by it that it calls into question their own self then...o well. I'm sure near naked girls on rap music, or slip knot's f**k the world mentality don't nearly as much influence the minds of youngins as much as Catherine's blog does (oh yeah and Big Brother too).

In any event it all boils down to unfairly judging someone soley on the fact that their life's ethic doesn't match up with their own. I don't agree with banging whoever whenever I want to, neither will I overtly agree with someone glorifying such behavior. But i'll be damned if I waste my time condemning them for it, thats the job of their conscience.

I am writing to apologise for the comment above that I posted earlier today. Having reread the comment, I have realised that, although I think that everything I said is true, it is not at all in line with my personal opinion and is much more aggressive than was originally intended. Many sincere apologies to Catherine for any bother caused.

Marcus

Dear all who think Catherine's column is past it's sell-by date...

...you're wrong.

It is invaluable for all those Indy readers who were either too busy to watch Sex and the City when it was trendy, or who are getting a little forgetful and need a refresher course.

Now, CT, how does one go about making your (personal) acquaintance?

hmm. I notice that the first nasty, seven postings on this thread were all sent within 40 minutes on the same Saturday evening.
Strangely, they all express similar negative comments. Funny that!
If people/a person genuinely don't find Catherine's stuff interesting, why are they here?
I love the fact the fact her column is completely different from the rest of the Indy.
And no, that doesn't mean I don't care deeply about what's going on in Burma...


I don't think for one moment that CT should resign or stop blogging. For what it is worth from scanning through the other Indy blogs this gets far more comments than most, and is usually worth a daily read - if only for something different.

However, the personal tone of a lot of the negative comments are unwarranted and surprisingly vindictive. At first I thought it was just some Christian Rght \ God Squad nutters with nothing better to do, but upon reflection they appear to be more personal than that.

Have you upset anyone recently CT? A disgruntled ex or an encounter who didn't like their write-up maybe?


Not following Russ' sound advice Matt?

Slow down everybody! Let's get this in perspective. I read previous blogs in which people commented directly about the horrific sexual abuse cases in Amstetten Austria. I am guessing that it probably caused ripples. I mean after reading about what happened to that woman maybe it left a bad feeling about blogs like these in which a young woman is seen to promote this sex with no limits or morality mentality? Because there have to be some boundaries because if there aren't any, look at what one man did to his family in Austria. It is an extreme case but a very shocking and disturbing one. CT has sex with a man and then later with his son too. Maybe that kind of behaviour is just upsetting? At this time more than any other there is a lot of sensitive stuff going on in the news regarding the Austrian sex abuse. It has hit a raw nerve. Of course there are many people who will now resent seeing sex treated like a trivial matter when it has implications. That's the message I am getting. Does Catherine realise that her behaviour is being viewed in light of what's going on elsewhere? I don't think it is personal and things are definitely related to what's going on in the news. It's something to think about.


I don't see how you can possibly link this blog to the Amstetten atrocity in any meaningful way. It just doesn't work on any level.

Are you seriously suggesting that we should all revert to the 19th century in our attiudes to sexual mores simply because the Fritzl case represents what ultimately happens when so-called "morality" and "boundaries" aren't present? Do you honestly think that these cases of horrific parental abuse don't happen in less permissive cultures too?

James I looked over several comments from previous blogs - about C Townsend and yes, there were comments about the current sexual abuse in Austria. Someone said it wasn't appropriate to keep peddling sex as entertainment in light of such shocking abuse - or words to that effect. It has thrown open questions about boundaries. Women are pointing out that CT's promiscuity also manages to perpetuate damaging stereotypes about women in general. Maybe it has touched on something else, other issues? For Catherine to sleep with a father and his son seems disgusting and that is my own personal opinion. Aren't there any boundaries anymore? Where do you draw the line? I can understand some of the points which readers have made on her recent blogs. Furthermore if Catherine is being paid to write on a national newspaper (and she has done for years I believe) then she can handle criticism.

One of the things I like best about CT's writing is the fact that she's human and flawed, she admits that she makes mistakes, she's been through her share of heartbreak, and she doesn't try to moralise...reading through her columns, she only discusses a couple of sexual partners in the last couple of months, hardly 'half the men in London' as one woman claimed, and certainly not shocking for a young unmarried woman living in the twenty-first century! A lot of my female friends have been much more active than Catherine, the difference is that they don't admit it. As a man, I can't recall anyone trying to demonise men in this way. And I can't help wondering why this is so personal and not about the wider debate?

For Catherine to sleep with a father and his son seems disgusting and that is my own personal opinion. Aren't there any boundaries anymore? Where do you draw the line?
-Paul Haines

The above sounds like a valid enough debate to me.

What does Catherine think of all this?
HInt, hint.

oh my post was deleted because whoops I mentioned Catherine's private parts....I thought that was the whole point, thinking and writing and drooling over certain parts of her anatomy and the thought of her doing it all over the place....seems like when you get down to the nitty gritty of Catherine's world The Independent gets all protective and judgemental....the thing is the reason why people get on their high horse about it is because it is as silly as mentioning someone's fanny and yet this column gets a place in a very respected newspaper...grrrrrr and that goes for the Claudia Winkel as well.

It's just not good journalism. I can't rate Catherine Townsend as a good journalist not ever. Her mindless blogs have continued unabated for years without scrutiny. Now that some people are actually asking why its being published on The Independent in the first place is a sign that the populace is realising what drivel it always was! I am amazed its been allowed to go on this long. Like I said its just crap journalism.

Every single one of of you who are complaining about catherine and her blog and how unentertaining it get a life if you are that displeased with it then why do you read it and continue to criticise it

sorry samantha, don't you know that if you want things changed in life you have to speak out not ignore it

Dear Marcus,


What your wrote was intense and powerful at the same time. Please don't apologize for it, I think it went straight and to the point as clear as day. Thank you for posting. \m/

-Angel


"Dear Catherine,

In response to the many of your blogs that I have now read, I find the fact that you are so openly promoting casual sex without discussing the negative aspects of your lifestyle very disturbing.

The atmosphere of your blogs belies the intended message that you are an independent woman enjoying a free lifestyle, instead conveying the impression that you are actually insecure, internally questioning your lifestyle but also seeking encouragement and approval from others in an attempt to console yourself, much in the way that a drug addict will attempt to promote drug use and seek solace with other addicts rather than face their own problems. Maybe you also think that you are a pioneering icon of femininity, in which case may I point out that the sexual revolution of the 60s was forty years ago and that you have been preceded by plenty of "high-profile" supersluts, many of whom have questionable self-esteem and states of mental health.

In reference to a comment on your blog "Sleeping around: What will the neighbours say" (in which you describe masturbating while your neighbour is watching you whilst the son of your ex-boyfriend, who you are also currently sleeping with, is away in the US) by Brigitta, I agree that your blogs do absolutely nothing to help the problems of men and women in society today. Have you ever considered that there are probably many young and insecure girls who read your blog? If I was an impressionable girl who was in a stable long-term relationship, reading your blog would make me feel that there was something wrong with me, that I was boring or unadventurous. Many of your blogs glorify promiscuity, without mentioning the increased risk of STDs, low self-esteem, psychological and financial insecurity, broken relationships and the possibility of being looked down on in society (whether you think this is right or wrong, it is a fact and applies to men as well; a quick look at many of the comments to your blogs provides some starting research).

I am not anti-sexual freedom in any way at all. I am also not anti-alcohol. But then I would also oppose someone writing blogs on behalf of a national mainstream newspaper about how great it was to be heavy drinker without stating the negative aspects of their lifestyle. What you do in your own life is your own business. However what I am opposed to is promoting your views as a role model with absolutely no regard for the consequences of your readership.

I have absolutely no idea how you managed to get your job at the Independent or why they feel that reporting such as yours is an asset to what is otherwise, for me, the leading newspaper in the UK. Is this some kind of crazily mistaken effort to make news cool for kids?"

I cant stand why people keep coming back here to slag Catherine off. I read her blog everyday, bought her book and sometimes I even read old posts to amuse myself, its a great way to be entertained during the dull hours of the office.

I would like to know why the people who are so concerned with issues being discussed here keep coming back, I may not agree with everything that is being said however it does not give me right to say what is right or wrong. And no I am not an imoral person, as a matter of fact I am a catholic, attend and respect the laws of the church.

However I also appreciate we live in modern times, things happen around us and we cannot stop the world from evolving, we need education to make society better, we need to teach people about making choices and having principles that goes a much longer way than teaching people how to be "pure"

People should be free to do whatever they feel most confortable with, regardless of their faith, background.

At the end of the day, its all about making choices and trust me no one is going to think more or less about you for having different views.

So you lot who are so narrow minded and judgmental better start reading the bibble as it tells you very clearly - those who have not sinned should throw the first stone! (and if you still havent got the message in modern times it means, stop judging because you will too be judged!)

Catherine congratulations! You are an amazing writer and I enjoy reading your adventures, everyday!

Keep it up!


I'm interested to understand why you think sex and relationships shouldn't be covered by a respected newspaper.

It's an important facet of human existence - in case you hadn't noticed you too are a sexual being. We have writers covering money, travel, the environment, education, health - so why not sex too?

I'm also bemused by the charge that CT is the worst Indie journalist. Has anyone actually read any of Mark Steel's efforts recently?

These people who've nothing better to do than post negative comments on a blog are just sad ... bugger.

If anyone else got paid - for YEARS by The Independent for writing/promoting a seedy sordid blog about voyeuristic porno blogs (supposed to titillate wheezy old men who don't have a real girlfriend) then I'm sure they'd be subject to the same criticism too.

If you read some of Catherine's earlier blogs like "What will the neighbours think" then you can see how she writes in a way where she is trying to titillate and arouse men. It's sad and no different from other written porn. I am personally not surprised that many women have been offended by it as it manages to represent women in a "willing sex objectification" kind of way. Sorry I really didn't want to have to say this but it is turning fast into the most pointless blog on The Independent which others have also said. It is a valid criticism. The concept for the blog is also outdated now, didn't someone mention it belonged pretty much in the nineties? They were right. Catherine is almost 40. Ten years after that will she still be behaving like this? How sad to think she is going to turn into one of those middle aged slappers who don't have anything else to offer but what's between their legs. I feel sorry for her. She really doesn't have anything else to offer.

I've know Catherine and she's 29 or 30. What would motivate "Phil" - who rarely leaves his bedroom - to place an outright lie and claim she's "almost 40". I suggest "Phil", whoever he or she is, tries to get a life and give up such pathetic rantings.
Remember "Phil", you don't HAVE to read the column if you don't like it. Either get a job or do something more worthwhile with your time.

Journos get paid to write durge. Readers respond in kind. Crux of the matter.

I am Becks and I'd just like to say my earlier posting was all rubbish and it is I wot is the crap writer! I luv Catherine's work.


I am really shocked. Not at the content of Catherine Townsend's witty, interesting and personal take on dating, sex and relationships in modern day society, but at the vitriolic nonsense written by narrow minded uptight people who cast a whole range of aspersions against her and no doubt every woman who dares to enjoy some sexual freedom in their life.

FYI Phil - Catherine is not 40! She is at least 10 years younger - which actually is irrelevant. What would it matter if she was? And why is it so shocking that a 40 year old woman could be sexually liberated?

Angel - Catherine does not promote herself as a role model and she has mentioned on several occasions the need to practice safe sex and to get regular STD check ups.

And last but not least - Marcus. My god. May I point out - as you seem to be unsure - you are not a young, impressionable girl. Now, I am sure you are shocked after that bombshell - but you do not have the insight, knowledge or right to write on the opinions of women. You are on a par with Tom Cruise lecturing women on what they should and should not do during and after child birth.

If you believe that having sexual freedom and liberation to enjoy sex brings you to the brink of financial disaster, makes you psychologically damaged and turns you in to a social outcast, then you need some help. NOW.

I think your attitude to women is extremely unhealthy and your rudeness to Catherine just because you disagree with her opinions, is a disgrace.

Catherine -you are a great writer. You are extremely funny and it is a welcome distraciton to read your weekly adventures. You should take it as a compliment that some poeple here think you are so influential you can single handedly change the way young women behave! But then, we shouldn't be able to think for ourselves should we.

To the other Becks has it occurred to you that SOMEONE ELSE could have the same name as yours? I posted earlier and I stand by what I wrote. It is poor quality writing. I wouldn't call this the work of a professional journalist no way.

To my American friend Becks, Way! (not a phrase we use here in the UK)
Still, good to know we've got a Shakespeare in the making (English - but you may have heard of him over there too) passing critical judgement on Catherine's work.
Back to the crayons for you as I suppose your "Mom" thinks pens are a little too sharp for Becksy-wecksy

Some replies to previous comments:

"DAVID SMITH"

"SHE ONLY discusses a couple of sexual partners in the last couple of months, hardly 'half the men in London' as one woman claimed, and certainly not shocking for a young unmarried woman living in the twenty-first century!"

We don't know if she has had sex with her neighbour yet, or who she's sleeping with without reporting it so let's put the figure at what I believe is a generously low one of 3 men per 2 months. That pans out at 18 people a year. Assuming I had a girlfriend of my age (24) and she lost her virginity at the age of 18 (generously high in my opinion), 6 years of 18 people a year is 108 people. I'm not really sure I would want my 24 year old girlfriend to have already had sex with 108 guys. Sorry, let me rephrase that, I AM sure that I would NOT want to have a serious relationship with a woman of any age who had slept with anywhere near that number of people and I would be highly surprised if I was alone in that opinion
NB just to pre-counter the mind-numbing sexist argument that I'm sure is on its way from someone - if I was a girl I would also not want to have a serious relationship with a guy who had slept with so many girls.

I read in an interview with Catherine that she lost her virginity when she was 15 years old and she is now 30 so, according to the relatively quiet patch figures, she has slept with 270 men. It is true, this is not "half the men in London", but it is certainly a high enough figure to be shocking for anyone living in any century and is also the amount of years ago that King George II was ruling England and Handel was the pop music.

"AS A MAN, I can't recall anyone trying to demonise men in this way."

You don't sound like a man, you sound like a feminist. Please put a link to your website on your future comments to clear up questions that have been raised about your identity. And to answer your point, it seems painfully obvious to me that people would have exactly the same opinion of a man who was boasting about their sexual exploits with hundreds of women.

"I'VE KNOW Catherine and she's 29 or 30. What would motivate "Phil" - who rarely leaves his bedroom - to place an outright lie and claim she's "almost 40". I suggest "Phil", whoever he or she is, tries to get a life and give up such pathetic rantings.
Remember "Phil", you don't HAVE to read the column if you don't like it. Either get a job or do something more worthwhile with your time."

Amazing and hilarious at the same time - looks like Phil hit "David's" hot spot.

MATTHEW

"IT'S NO different than standing on a street corner and shouting out I'm a hoe"

I think it is greatly different to standing on a street corner and shouting "I'm a ho" as someone who did that would not have access to many listeners, would not be portrayed in a positive light and also would not have the backing of a respected newspaper.


"I'M SURE near naked girls on rap music, or slip knot's f**k the world mentality don't nearly as much influence the minds of youngins"

I think it is true that music videos probably do have more influence than Catherine's blog.

However, considering female artists, themselves dressed in revealing clothes - I don't think that the image the female artists are trying to give off by wearing revealing clothes is that they live a promiscuous lifestyle - rather they want to be seen as beautiful and sexy and have the power to attract whichever man they want. I don't think that a woman wanting to look beautiful and wear sexy clothes would lead to as many problems as a woman who was aiming to emulate Catherine's lifestyle.

Considering male artists promoting female models in revealing clothes - I think that the scantily women who are hanging off some male artists arms are not as influential to other women as the above because they are widely seen to be subserviant to the male artist. I believe that role models are those who look powerful and comfortable in their lifestyle, not those who are supporting someone else's success. For example, I am a man and I would be much more influenced by how a male artist was acting than by how a female artist's subserviant dancer was acting (ps for the feminists - there are lots of example's of this eg. Madonna and Britney Spears etc. so I do think that their is a fair balance in pop music media)

Also, music videos are entertainment (there are not many people who don't know that the film was planned and the dancers are paid models), whereas Catherine's blog is fact, on a national newspaper and is therefore representing the London relationship "scene". I think when a newspaper such as the Independent has someone like Catherine covering the relationship section, the result is that the impression of the London dating scene given off is not accurate in any way and provides a drastically mistaken stereotype which will alienate many people who do not feel that are involved in it.

As for slipknot's mentality - I don't really know what they are about as I don't listen to them, but, as for a "f**k the world mentality", I think it is a healthier mentality than that of Catherine's blog - at least it shows some kind of ability (albeit basic and unrefined) to detect that there are massive problems in the world that you are not happy about and is a breeding ground for independent and questioning reasoning. Conversely the mentality of Catherine's blog is to promote the feeling of well-being without acknowledging that what she is promoting may well lead to problems.

PAULA

"I WOULD like to know why the people who are so concerned with issues being discussed here keep coming back."

Because they are so concerned with the issues being discussed.

"AND NO I am not an imoral person, as a matter of fact I am a catholic, attend and respect the laws of the church."

Being a Catholic does not automatically validate or invalidate anything you say, or make you moral or immoral - please leave religion out of the debate.

"PEOPLE SHOULD be free to do whatever they feel most confortable with, regardless of their faith, background."

Yes they should and very few people on the blog are disputing this.

JAMES

"I'M INTERESTED to understand why you think sex and relationships shouldn't be covered by a respected newspaper."

The impression I get from the comments here is not that people think that these topics should not be covered, but rather that Catherine is the wrong person for the job. My personal belief is that having a radical feminist to cover the relatinship section is akin to having a zionist jew covering topics concerning the palestine-israeli conflict. To balance Catherine out, they should at least also employ a male chauvinist pig to promote stringing women along for casual sex.

JAMES (not sure if this is the same James so keeping it separate)

"HAVE YOU upset anyone recently CT? A disgruntled ex or an encounter who didn't like their write-up maybe?"

If it is me that you are referring to, I can happily and honestly deny all charges!


ANGEL

Angel, thank you so much for your kind support. There are a couple of reasons I apologised.

Firstly, I do think that the first comment I wrote was much too personal and aggressive. Catherine does not give off the impression of someone with high confidence so I felt guilty.

Secondly, I do not think Catherine is the main problem here. I personally really don't mind what she does in her own life and I also think that she genuinely believes that her blogs are not causing any harm but are promoting freedom for women. Therefore I regretted sending such a personal attack on someone who I feel has low confidence and feels that they are doing the right thing. The people who I have a problem with now are Catherine's employers who, in my opinion, are using Catherine's blog of insanity to promote their business, without considering the consequences it will have for readers and also for Catherine (who I'm sure would be unable to continue her career if she settled down and had a family life).

I have read some of your other postings and although there are some topics on which I don't know enough about to add my opinion, it is really great to see someone who has the guts to say what they think, even if it is going against what is falsely considered to be "independent, modern thinking". Please continue to add your interesting posts to these debates.

LAST BUT ALSO LEAST, FERNANDA

Thank you for ignoring the apology I posted just a few hours after posting my original comment and daring to go ahead with an ill-researched attack on my personality which has given me pleny of opportunity to further express my views on this ongoing debate.


"I AM really shocked. Not at the content of Catherine Townsend's witty, interesting and personal take on dating, sex and relationships in modern day society, but at the vitriolic nonsense written by narrow minded uptight people who cast a whole range of aspersions against her and no doubt every woman who dares to enjoy some sexual freedom in their life.

Really amazing that, in your first sentence about casting aspersions against Catherine, you yourself cast aspersions against anyone who dares to question her viewpoint.

You also refer to Catherine's blog as witty, interesting and personal take on dating, sex and relationships in modern day society which not only states your opinions as facts but also implies that you think wild promiscuity is an expected part of relationships in modern day society.

Also interesting (a point that I will be coming back to) is that you describe Catherine's promiscuity as daring "to enjoy some sexual freedom in their life" - Don't you know that a girl who also has one partner for their whole life is also daring to enjoy her sexual freedom?


re. Angel's comment

"CATHERINE DOES not promote herself as a role model and she has mentioned on several occasions the need to practice safe sex and to get regular STD check ups."

The fact that she is writing her blogs on behalf of a national newspaper automatically promotes her to the level of a role model. The fact that she has to have regular STD checkups means that she herself feels she has a greater risk of STD than someone who is not "sleeping around". It is basic probability that if you have sex with 100 people a year then you have a higher chance of getting an STD than someone who sleeps with 1 person a year. I'm sorry, that is not an opinion, it is a fact. If anyone is still disputing this, please pick up a children's maths book or do some research into how sexually transmitted diseases are transmitted.


re - my comment

"MY GOD. May I point out - as you seem to be unsure - you are not a young, impressionable girl. Now, I am sure you are shocked after that bombshell"

No, I'm not shocked at all - sorry to disappoint.


"IF YOU believe that having sexual freedom and liberation to enjoy sex brings you to the brink of financial disaster, makes you psychologically damaged and turns you in to a social outcast, then you need some help. NOW."

I really shouldn't have to explain this one as it is clearly due to you not reading, or not understanding what I wrote - I'm not sure if it is English vocabulary or grammar that you have a problem with, but taking some choice quotes from my comment......


"I am not anti-sexual freedom in any way at all" and "I completely agree with freedom of choice"

These phrases mean that I think that people should be free to do what they want sexually. I do not think that sexual freedom causes any of the effects you have described. Please see below where it is explained that this problem is simply down to you replacing what I wrote with your own phrases.


"Many of your blogs glorify promiscuity, without mentioning the increased risk of STDs, low self-esteem, psychological and financial insecurity, broken relationships and the possibility of being looked down on in society"

Your quote "having sexual freedom and liberation to enjoy sex" has been wrongly attributed to what I wrote "(glorify) promiscuity". The two are greatly different. The fact that you have replaced my meaning of promiscuity with sexual freedom and liberation, strengthens my belief that feminists only promote sexual freedom when it means promiscuity. From your attitude, it seems that if a girl chose to have one partner and become a child-bearing housewife you would not attribute this to her freedom of choice but rather to the "sexist" culture of modern society. You are only promoting sexual "freedom" as long as it's the kind of freedom that you condone (which, by the way, is not freedom).

Aside from that, "increased risk" does not mean that I think it will (referring to your extrapolated extremes) bring someone to financial ruin, make them psychologically damaged or turn them into a social outcast. It does not even explicitly mean that I think there will be any difference in these factors.... It simply means that I think there is a generally higher probablilty of these states occuring if you live a promiscuos, unsettled lifestyle than if you have a long term, stable partner.

Please go back to primary school and learn how to read. NOW.


"I THINK your attitude to women is extremely unhealthy and your rudeness to Catherine just because you disagree with her opinions, is a disgrace."

I also think that your debating style is extremely unhealthy and actually, I don't disagree with Catherine's opinions because she doesn't seem to have any. All of her "opinions" could be constructed by a simple feminist formula that a 4 year old could calculate . The only disgrace here is you insulting my attitude without bothering to read what I wrote and putting false quotes into your discussion of my comment to back up your opinion.

"BUT THEN, we shouldn't be able to think for ourselves should we."

You should be able to think for yourself, but unfortunately, the size of your brain is holding you back from achieving this goal.

The recurring theme of attack against mine and others' comments in this blog is the manipulation that disputing feminism means that you are up-tight, sexist, a religious fundamentalist or have some problem relating to women or a "disgusting attitude" etc. Well I'm sorry, I just don't buy it. I'm quite confident that my attitudes to relationships are nowhere near approaching the aforementioned and frankly, there are a few important women in my life (all of them complete with a brain and independent thought) and I don't think that my attitude towards any of them is unhealthy in any way at all but thank you for your concern, I'll let them know that you are thinking of them in this time of crisis.


oh get a bloody life Marcus

Good grief I wish people had brains. Great work as always Catherine. Don't let these prudish, childish idiots who think sex is naughty get you down. They just need to grow up. Fast. Maybe after they get weaned off their mother's milk they'll open their eyes and FINALLY see the world for what it really is. If they don't like your blogs why do they keep reading them?

Have't actually read any of her articles, but she is cute in her photo, she is obviously bright as well as attractive, and if she wants to have sex and tell other people about it, that is her right, they do not have to read about it. However, I do question the point of a newspaper like the Independent publishing this, as the sexual revolution is approaching 50, and for the most part anyone can do almost anything sexually they want, then there is really no intrinsic intellectual value to the SA blog. Instead, it seems like high-brow titilation- and that's a sort of dishonest way to pawn off porn without admitting that's what it is cause you are the self-righteous 'Independent'. However, more to the point is CT, as I said she is pretty and smart, why doesn't she do something more effective now, no problem to move on sweetie, this was fun, but as you could do something more with your life than why not? Sex might even be more fun if you really had a private relationship, deep relationship, with trust and love, with the other person, and didn't write about or allude to them in a blog- then they are no longer your focus but a means to an end- a display. Just like the guy who brags about the girl he slept with a thus denegrates her, and himself. Sometimes keeping something between two people makes it more valuable. Good luck CT, get out before it gets you.
PS- no joke about the STD, I got a bad one and the woman who I got it from did not even know she was infected.

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