It is ludicrous of the Chinese authorities to accuse the Dalai Lama, holder of the Nobel Peace Prize, of inciting violence. He has consistently advocated non-violence and constructive dialogue - even abandoning demands for outright independence for Tibet.

For the past half century, the ethnic Tibetan people have endured a brutal authoritarian regime which has tried to crush their religion and swamp their culture. While the resulting frustration may have boiled over in the form of some violence from the demonstrators, the great majority of the bloodshed seems to have been from over-reaction by the security forces.

It is good that Gordon Brown has finally agreed to meet the Dalai Lama and to speak to the Chinese government about human rights. Compassion is far more important than economic advantage.

Did anyone notice the immediate effort by the ChiComs to scuttle this meeting? The ChiComs, according to the article, require the Dalai Lama to acknowledge Taiwan as part of China as a prerequisite. What does that have to do with Tibet? Obviously the ChiComs have no intention of this meeting taking place. It's either that or forcing the Dalai Lama to take sides on an issue he's not party to under the threat of yet more ChiCom efforts to murder Tibetans.

As you all can see. It is clear now that the Chinese government is actually paying people to comment on western sites. They spew only propaganda. And it is easy to spot. It is all over this site, news.com, youtube and many others. It is designed to make you believe that the world is actually not united on the Tibet matter. But we know the truth.

Boycott the Olympics!! The Dalai Lama, are innocent people who feel like they are being picked on by China. We cannot ignore this problem. We can not let this problem go on and give it the cold shoulder, we did that once in history and looked what happened. We should get the Pope, and every leader who has some say so involved. Let the people be themselves.

Hey, Dustin. Where are you? How do you that "the Chinese government is actually paying people to comment on western sites"? Do you have any receipts of the payment? Do you have anyone who received the money? If not, do not tell rumours. Do not mislead people.

It is really enlightening to read the western sites. It is enlightening because they are really good teaching materials for the Chinese like me to know that there are people like you who are making wild guesses about China and the Chinese. It is enlightening because they like you cannot really understand why Chinese do not like western sites on the issue of Xizang (Tibet). From the websites of BBC, CNN, and many other western sites, the Chinese people can see very biased and misleading views and reports. It is really a good lesson to see the true faces of those self-claimed unbiased western reports and websites.

Why do you use the word "It is clear now that ...". How clear are you?

Maybe you hate the communists, but I beg you not to hate the Chinese people.

I tell you that the Chinese people support the Chinese government to bring Lasah to peace in the riot a week ago. We are with the Government on this issue.

I beg you people not to stand up to support the Dalai Lama clique for their efforts to drive away all other ethnic groups and to have Xizang for only their people. That will arouse a much more serious human disaster.

Why you people could not stand up to support the equal and brotherly relations between the Xizang people (Tibetans) and the Han people and other ethnic groups?

You said you "know the truth." What do you know? You only know the truth that has been made up or misled by your western sites.

Wake up, man. Here is a website popular among overseas Chinese. http://club.backchina.com/main/forumdisplay.php?fid=37

Learn some Chinese and you will know the truth.

Neil， you have been in Beijing and Tibet but that does not mean you know the truth. You have friends there but that does not mean that you can tell lies. The phrase "another paid-to-post Agent of the CPC!!" has stripped you of your mask. You are accusing Jane Swann and me of "paid-to-post". Then please answer this simple question "do you have any proof that these two people are paid?" Show it here in this forum. False accusation can send you into jail.

You are sure not to be trusted at least about the accusation "paid-to-post". That will tell me that you also make wild guesses.

If you continue tell lies like that, you are not welcome to China.

I'm not Chinese, and to spare everyone some curiosity I'm an Arab, Palestinian to be more precise. While I do not know much about the Tibet topic and can not agree or disagree, I do know that the 8 million Palestinians in exile have been fighting to return their homeland for the last 60 years (our home land is not only the Gaza strip and a few cities in the West Bank). We are only mentioned as terrorist extremists, and our killing is blessed by the British media.

Recently we have seen East Timor and Kosovo given their independence by the West. Now the conflict in Tibet which is as old as the Palestinian struggle against occupation is taking centre square within Western circles. The only difference is that this one has been reignited with the arrival of the Olympics games to China, and the Palestinian one has been active ever since the British "mandate" occupation and the creation of Israel in 1948 as home for Jews from all over the world.

Therefore, I can not sympathise much with a Western intelligence created event. We see similar events like this created from time to time in countries where the West has no puppet regimes installed. The double standards of the British government makes me sick. What is a human right for some people, is punishable by death for others (even it were committed by proxy).

The Dalai Lama is walking the tight rope of the courageous. And the Chinese are brandishing the crude power of the rich.
He has never done anything that betrayed our trust and trhey have done little to gain it [Darfur, Burma, etc] So let us help Brown to use persuasion and negotiation powers that changed the Irish situation, the Indian situation, the Malayian situation, and help persuade the Chinese.

Mind you I think nothing will persuade them once they are fixed on their path as their arrogance is unending.... very like those who invaded Iraq, nothing changes their perception, even when it is in their interest to change!

@Julius

>> . False accusation can send you into jail. <<

Actually, Julius, ANYTHING can send you to jail in the corrupt Communist-controlled People's Republic of China.

It's fascinating how the first thing to come out of your mouth is threats and intimidation - the characteristic behaviour of a paid Communist Party uniformed bully-boy.

Why do you use the name "Julius"?? Because you think you are an Emperor??? ROFL!!! Afraid to use your real Chinese name! And trying to appear like you are a foreigner expressing an opinion... instead of a CPC Official serving the will of a one-party Communist dictatorship :((

You prattle about the truth, but you kick all the journalists out... we're supposed to accept the Press-Release of a petit-demagogue would-be Julius Caesar as the truth??? ROFL!!!

Here's the truth about China - filmed by Sky News, your ally Mr Murdoch!!! But you'll never see THIS truth on your crappy CCTV-9 pack of LIES!!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=x6M7NzTrrzs

(YouTube is currently banned in the "free" country of China, of course... along with the BBC, CNN, and most other reputable broadcasters. The gutless lies of Xinhua are the only "truth" (HA!) available there.

After the way the Americans and British have behaved in Iraq what moral grounds do we have to preach to the Chinese?

Reading Nancy Pelosi's homily about how responsible nations should behave is nauseatingly hollow in the context of our actions.

This hypocrisy disqualifies both us and the Americans from having any credibility in making suggestions as to how Tibet should move on. We should shut up and get our own house in order first.

Dear Colleague,

As the representative to the United Nations, Geneva, of the Association of World Citizens, I have written on 15 March to the Chinese Ambassador concerning the recent protests in the Tibet Autonomous Region (TAR) and other Tibetan-majority areas. I stress the need for the rule-of-law, fair trials, the need for representative political institutions where ideas can be freely discussed, and for the development of a pluralistic civil society. Although I have made these points before, I believe that they need to be made again in the light of growing frustration on the part of many Tibetans and the danger of increased political and police repression. The text of my letter is given below.
Letters stressing similar points could be usefully sent to the recently re-elected President Hu Jintao,
The State Council General Office, 2 Fuyoujie, Xichengqu, Beijingshi, 100017, China,

The Minister of Justice, Wu Aiying, Ministry of Justice, 10 Nandajie Chaoyangmen, Chaoyangqu, Beijingshi 100020, China and
Minister of Foreign Affairs, Li Zhaoxing
Ministry of Foreign Affairs, 2 Chaoyangmen Nandajie, Chaoyang District, Beijingshi,
100701, China

With all best wishes, Rene Wadlow

March 15, 2008

Excellency :

The Association of World Citizens would like to join in with many others, both governments and non-governmental organizations, in calling for respect for human rights and the rule of law in dealing with the current demonstrations in Lhasa and other Tibetan-majority areas.

World Citizens have always stressed the need for broadly-based democratic institutions through which people may express their ideas and proposals for change. As necessary as fair elections are for good governance, such broadly-based institutions need to be more than periodic elections to government institutions. That is why World Citizens have stressed the role of civil society and the need for a multitude of social groups so that many views can be expressed.

When such institutions of civil society are limited, when the press and the media are not pluralistic, then people will express their views in demonstrations and protests which can become violent both through the actions of protesters and of the police and security forces. That is what we see today in different parts of Tibet. Because of visitors, there is more reporting from Lhasa, but we understand that there have been demonstrations and repression in other Tibetan-majority areas.

/...

H. E. Mr. Li Baodong

Ambassador Extraordinary and Plenipotentiary

Permanent Representative

of the People’s Republic of China

to the United Nations Office at Geneva

Chemin de Surville 11

C. P. 85

1213 Petit-Lancy 2

Switzerland

- 2 -

Many Tibetans feel that their aspirations are not taken into consideration, their culture is not respected, and that they are marginalized in the process of economic development. Many Tibetans believe that the current political structures in the Tibet Autonomous Region do not adequately reflect their views. Thus, aspirations are articulated from the more traditional sources of authority, that is, the monks from the leading monasteries.

The current unrest is a sign that the social order is not healthy. There is Tibetan resentment against Han workers and Hui merchants living in Lhasa.

Thus, we encourage care and respect for all individuals in the restoration of order. However, more important beyond the short-term issues concerning arrests and fair trials, there is the longer-range need to create representative governmental institutions in which Tibetans have the possibility to express their views. There is also the need to develop civil society institutions to carry out social, cultural and economic activities for the benefit of all.

World Citizens responded actively to the Buddhist monk-led demonstrations for the rule of law in Myanmar last September and October. The world is now watching as monks again lead a broad effort for freedom of thought and social justice.

We are sure that the Government of the People’s Republic of China will follow internationally-recognized standards of human rights in the current situation and will also undertake a serious study of the reforms needed in Tibet.

Respectfully Yours,

Prof. René Wadlow

Chief Representative to the United Nations¾Geneva

Association of World Citizens

I love the fact that people immediately jump to the conclusion that those chinese citizens commenting on this site in support of the CCP must be spies. This is an unbelievably arrogant comment to make. The reality is that the majority of the Chinese population, rightly or wrongly, believe Tibet to be a part of China, just as they believe Taiwan to be. The abusive comments written by the likes of Neil help no-one.

It is clear that the actions of the CCP are morally reprehensible and that Tibet should be given the autonomy that the name T.A.R. implies. However, the descent of the protests into violence has not helped the situation. I cannot think of a case of any government responding kindly to a "protest" in which the "protestors" engaged in acts of racial hatred and murdered innocent civilians, acts which have been well documented by westerners present in Tibet at the time (see Times articles). No matter what crimes were inflicted on the population murder is never justified and I would like to think that it would not be tolerated by any government.

In contrast the Dalai Lama has taken the right approach: an emphasis on non-violence and a call for constructive dialogue and a peaceful resolution. Let's hope he is successful.

The Dalai Lama should definitely go, but not alone. This is the time to go with a high media presence so that the visit is given a very high profile - the Chinese are concerned about their image pre Olympics and this is the time to tarnish it as much as possible - go with a politician (UN intermediary? Gordon Brown - as if!) and as much media as he can muster - Richard Gere?

Good luck to him and poor Tibet - the west does so little to support Tibet, now is the time to show political and moral solidarity.

Freedom of speech in Europe or America? Yes, to a degree that is larger than in China where most people are still peasants and the GDP of 1.3 billion people is barely more than that of France which has 60 million people.

However, Free Speech is a much overused phrase that those in power often resort to using to try and give us the impression that we are free when of course most of us are not, being enslaved in various "systems", most notably the debt based banking system.

There is also no such thing as the Free Press. Anybody who believes this should be shot and having been banned by the Guardian's "Comment is Free" Internet forum four times under different names simply for mentioning one particular family of immense power and influence I can tell you that Internet forums are not free either. They are all censored.

Whilst the continued occupation of Tibet is detestable we should first of all free ourselves before being too concerned with others.

@Julius

More threats. More lies. More accusations. Typical commisar behaviour.

And you won't look at the YouTube clip, will you? The truth is too hard to contemplate for you :((

What you say about journalists is a LIE. CPC won't let any foreign journalists into Tibet, and threw out those already there. There's a news blackout from Tibet.

Hi Julius, you may be right in suggesting that the Dalai Lama should go to China, but not “alone”. In 1989 The Panchen Lama suddenly and mysteriously died after delivering a strong criticism of the Chinese government. It is believed that he was poisoned. This should be a clear reminder for the advisers of the Dalai Lama.

The native american advice of 'white man speaks with forked tongue' also applies to Chinese colonialists obviously...and this is the way to face them out - two wrongs don't make a right, wether Iraq or Tibet. Its a matter of genocide of indigenous people by total and complete scum - something that western auto leftists should be aware of. Old Tibet, as all indigenous people, provide solutions and hope to the eco-armagedeon that is happening right now, and has been thorougly reported by the Independent. In fact, Independent, you need to provide genuine solutions when you highlight the eco-cide. Take a look at Ladakh for example:

http://www.eco-action.org/dt/ladakh.html

Many of the ideas in 'Permaculture' originate from indigenous, native type systems - i.e. living/agriculture systems that are in balance with the Sacred Mother Earth.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permaculture

In practice the Chinese state are obviously extremely, pyscopathically even, hostile towards His Holiness and so I would suggest any meeting should happen in a third country.

I hope the Dalai Lama does have a meeting with the leaders of the PRC, but only in a neutral setting policed by others.
The perception is that they cannot be trusted and their abuse of human rights is well documented.
Please take care Dalai Lama and best wishes

I agree Bill, we ought to leave other countries to sort out their own problems by themselves. Our media can report the facts if they can manage impartial reporting, by that I don't mean printing a judgemental missive.It should not be the job of our governments to achieve a particular political outcome or settlement in another country. We have not voted for them to do that. The lobbyist from other countries should also stop persuading the government and media for their own selfish ends. We can not police all the world, we can not tell everybody how they should live their lives by our standards there.We must really stop meddling in another country's affairs:By creating divisions amongst different people we only create more wars and hatred for us.Our governments in the west must stop installing regimes in politically and economically weak countries.This only will lead to more wars and genocide as we have seen. Regarding His Holiness Dalai Lama whom is the spiritual leader of the Tibetan people.Why would he associate himself with the already tarnished leaders in the west?
Tizab

Neil, are you sure you've read my replies carefully?

Why don't you answer my simple question "do you have any proof that these two people are paid-to-post? and show it to us if you have.

Samten, are you sure you've also read my comments carefully?

I have not made any suggestion that Dalai Lama go to China, let alone to go there alone.

If you ask me for suggestions, I would like to say I wish you people give your support to the Chinese so that the Chinese, whether they are Han, or Tibetans, or Muslims, or any other ethnic groups, could hold their hands to work together for a better life, rather than support one to hate the other.

If Dalai Lama wants to go to China, he is welcome to come talk about how to help people there lead a better life but not dividing China country into pieces.

This is the very important issue and every one should involve in this.

It is funny to hear people from the West (yet again) giving other countries an advise how to run their affairs. I am not Chinese but I will say this: The Independent is a British newspaper. So how about this question for people from the UK - why dont you grant independence to Northern Ireland? Why did you send military troops and attacked civilians there? What is the problem with granting independence to Scotland and Wales? And why not break up Spain, Belgium, Germany, Italy, Canada - all countries that either were separated or have communities that would like to go on their own. The West is very good about invading and destroying other countries. Why doesnt it take its own medicine sometime? China has every right to defend itself. And this so called international outcry about Tibet is just a frustration on part of the West that now it is powerless and cannot just simply invade and kill people there. China is just too strong for them.

The Dalai Lama feels the need to travel to Beijing and so he should, but with his own personally-chosen bodyguards and foodtasters, plus international observers/military and press. The Chinese government need to realise that Tibet is not their country and they should give it back. This year, with the Olympic Games to be held in Beijing, is an important year for Tibetan freedom. Gordon Brown should definitely meet the Dalai Lama.

It is pathetic to witness the impotency of "world powers" in merely speaking out against the brutality against Tibeteans. The fear of China's military might, Tibet's unteresting importance as a resource rich nation, West's colonial history, trade interests,loss of moral authority beacuse of past/current meddling and exploitation of situations in middle east and elsewhere have created an unfathomable void in the politician's response leaving the task to us commoners. STAND UP and show that the world will not watch these happenings. Next to you buy anything make the right choice of products. Let IOC do what they want to. We can boycott the 2008 telecasts. That would be our contribution!

Boycott China as a whole. Leaders and businessmen won't ; they rather would export jobs there.

Hey, Julius : how do know there is chinese PR on the web sites ? just see how they repeat the official propaganda 'tibet part of china' 'DL terrorist' 'liberation of tibet from serfdom and obscurantism' They indeed mislead people, but usually their langage is so poor that you can identify this prop quite immediately.

How enlightening to read these comments, they tell so much about the brutal nature of the regime that pays them.

Your wild guess is that people here will swallow those hollow arguments like people in china do.
No need to speak chinese to understand the reality of the colonialist PCC regime and its stalinian propaganda.

Tibet, Kham and Amdo are not part of China. Your selfclaimed possessino of these people and territories just foul yourself.

How stunning to claim being such a big country and being in so much denial and fear.

I do not hate the Chinese people, I am myself a long time admirer and practitioner of chinese culture, taïchi, chiquong, tao. Anyway, the way chinese minds is getting brainwashed by stalinian propaganda does not incline to admiration, to say the least

"We are with the Government on this issue" what a surprise !

"Dalai Lama clique for their efforts to drive away all other ethnic groups and to have Xizang for only their people" : such arguments are stupid, can only be swallowed by brainwashed minds. It expresses the worst stalinian propaganda, but open your eyes : every body admires the Dalai-Lama for its unrivalled human qualities, you are making fools of yourself.
And for the ethnic argument : that's their country, not yours. Go home !

"Why you people could not stand up to support the equal and brotherly relations between the Xizang people (Tibetans) and the Han people and other ethnic groups?"
you must be talking of the arrogance and feeling of superiority of the Han, aren't you ? that's your vision of brotherly relations I guess..

"You said you "know the truth." What do you know? You only know the truth that has been made up or misled by your western sites."
Not only, tourists speak, so do tibetans too. And your glorious government takes all measures to prevent any free information, doesn'it ?

"Wake up, man." Yes it is about time !